The West African Yoruba goddess Yewa(the Yoruba of West Africa insist that their ancestors had been immigrants from the Nile region via the Lake Chad region)... The goddess Yewa(YHWH) becomes a model of the spirit possession medium in the spirit possession cult of Sango. The spirit of Sango, in turn, becomes the mythical seed of the heavens fallen to the earth: the bini ha-loyim (sons of God) who observing the beauty of the daughters of men (binot ha-'adam) chose wives from among them and produced as sons, the ha-gibbor-iym (men of fame, heroes of old).

The double-head of the thunder god's axe, in Yoruba tradition, is a symbol of the essentially two-faced androgynous (Sango-Yewa) nature of cosmic deity in his-her synthetic sky-earth identity (which explains why Sango is the patron deity of twins in the Yoruba pantheon of gods). In Yoruba tradition, the double axe-head of Sango is usually mounted on a female figurine: a representation of the Sango's feminine alter ego or doppelganger, that is, the chthonic goddess Yewa, in her model role as spirit possession medium in Sango's afterlife deification (Sango is supposed, like Jesus, to have died by hanging). The Yoruba believe, like Christians do, that the god Sango lived on, in the skyey realms, after he had apparently died on the stake, watching over mankind and punishing the wicked with lightning bolts from the heavens. John Thomas Didymus, author of "Confessions of God: The Gospel According to St. John Thomas Didymus.

 

 

The double axe symbol has been found at the egyptian City of the Hawk signifying two lands. In this ancient city It is the Desheret symbol of sedge and bee. Desheret has been shown to have a root connection to Deborah, Hebrew word for bee. http://bycommonconsent.com/2006/11/03/bcc-papers-1-2-barney/

 

The root of Deborah is Dabar (word of God) and is used more than 2.500 times in the Old Testament (first in Genesis 12:4). Over 110 English words and phrases are used to translate this one word alone. Dabar is used as the Order of Mechelzedek, the inner sanctum of the Holy of Holies, and the Word of God. It is used as Oracle, flit, speak, language, etc. Bee symbols are at the very heart of the afro-semetic language. Mn was the Egyptian god of the hive. The miraculous appearance of honey was attributed to him. Mn (with added Hebrew Heh) could be the Mannah (honeycomb) of Moses' Exodus sustaining the Israelites in the wilderness. I think it is interesting that the earliest Aramaic churches were hexagram shaped - a replica of a honeycomb cell. The hexagram shape is also the shape of the "inner sanctum" of the Magen David.

 

Beekeepers must be very careful and not introduce foreign organisms into hive. Hive collapse is a common and mysterious event. Even modern man has not fully solved this problem. The purity laws proscribed by priests entering the DBR/Inner Sanctum were quite specific. This priest must live 12 cubits from anyone else (and be downwind.) He must not have a discharge or come in contact with anyone that has a discharge within 7 days. He must bathe and then not touch any other part of his body with his hands. If he touches anything at all, he must wash his hands before he enters the inner sanctum. The man dedicated to entering the DBR would need to be supported because ritual purity requires intense effort and concentration. As a culture was built around the DBR, common symbols were deployed to build language required for the cooperative effort.

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How interesting you chose this guys material to quote. I'm assuming you have read his blog and the ones he links to.

Unfortunately there are a couple of teensy weency mistakes.

Right now I'll deal with just one. Dabar does not mean word of God. Dabar means word, statement, act or thing depending on the context. Dabar is generic, the word can be anyones. To have "word of God" you would have to say Dabar Yahweh or Ha-Dabar Elohim. Yahweh and Elohim being God in either phrase.
"The root of Deborah is Dabar (word of God) and is used more than 2.500 times in the Old Testament (first in Genesis 12:4). "

Continuing on from the last post, did you know that Dabar is pronounced "daw-baw" and Deborah is pronounced, well its self explanatory but I will type it up anyway, "deb-or-ahh". Hebrew initially did not have vowels and the word dabar would have simply been dbr but the b can also be a v so you can have dvr and it is the same word. Furthermore to confuse the issue further the context of the phrase is all important because you could actually have an epidemic happening instead of someone speaking.

Look up Strongs and check out
1697 דָּבָר da-var Word
1698 דֶּבֶר de-ver Epidemic
The only difference between the 2 is the vowel accents. No vowels in the original manuscripts means you really need to have the correct context. The ancient hand written script is, while different to the typeset, the same with both words and to top it all off the ancient hand writing did not have vowel signs. Strongs also has that so you can check it out as well.

Point of this is, take everything in the correct context
Susan, you are making great connections here! It is amazing how the pieces start to fall into place when one looks in the right place for information.

Ezekiel was told to eat the scroll - the word of God - and he found it sweet. I've read that the manna eaten in the wilderness might have been honeycomb.

Biblical Archaeology Review recently reported on "finds from Tel Rehov shed a bright light on domestic religious observance in ancient Israel and, like so many archaeological finds, raise unanswered questions, reminding us how little we really know. At 25 acres, Tel Rehov is one of the largest mounds in Israel. It is located a little more than half way up the Jordan Valley between the Dead Sea and the Sea of Galilee.

Rehov is mentioned in several Egyptian inscriptions. The latest one is an inscription of Shoshenq I at the temple of Amun at Karnak, Thebes. That inscription records more than 150 place names in relation to Shoshenq’s military campaign in the Land of Israel, around 925–920 B.C.E. This military campaign is also mentioned in the Bible, where Shoshenq is referred to as “Shishak” and the event is dated by the Biblical historiographer to the fifth year of King Rehoboam’s reign, shortly after Solomon’s death and the breakup of the United Kingdom into the separate states of Israel and Judah (1 Kings 14:25–28; 2 Chronicles 12:2–9)."

The beehives were evidence of an advanced honey-producing beekeeping industry 3000 years ago. There were 100 hives in neat rows. Tel Rehov was stronlgy influenced by Egyptian/Sudanese culture although these bees were more like the Antalyan bee of central Turkey.
Michael,
You are correct. It is not "word of God" but merely "word". Thanks for that correction.

The Afro-asiatic family of languages is built using 2 or 3 letter roots. You must go back to the root of the word to understand the meaning of how the word is used. This root harkens back to Egypt and the merging of two cultures; the tuber feeders and the beekeepers. I can definitely see how DBR could be used to describe a famine. The tubers and honey are gifts of fruitfulness from God. When God takes his gifts away, famine ensues.

Did you look at the link that I provided?


Michael Findlay said:
"The root of Deborah is Dabar (word of God) and is used more than 2.500 times in the Old Testament (first in Genesis 12:4). "

Continuing on from the last post, did you know that Dabar is pronounced "daw-baw" and Deborah is pronounced, well its self explanatory but I will type it up anyway, "deb-or-ahh". Hebrew initially did not have vowels and the word dabar would have simply been dbr but the b can also be a v so you can have dvr and it is the same word. Furthermore to confuse the issue further the context of the phrase is all important because you could actually have an epidemic happening instead of someone speaking.

Look up Strongs and check out
1697 דָּבָר da-var Word
1698 דֶּבֶר de-ver Epidemic
The only difference between the 2 is the vowel accents. No vowels in the original manuscripts means you really need to have the correct context. The ancient hand written script is, while different to the typeset, the same with both words and to top it all off the ancient hand writing did not have vowel signs. Strongs also has that so you can check it out as well.

Point of this is, take everything in the correct context
I have not read everything he has written but what I have read I am in complete agreement.

Michael Findlay said:
How interesting you chose this guys material to quote. I'm assuming you have read his blog and the ones he links to.

Unfortunately there are a couple of teensy weency mistakes.

Right now I'll deal with just one. Dabar does not mean word of God. Dabar means word, statement, act or thing depending on the context. Dabar is generic, the word can be anyones. To have "word of God" you would have to say Dabar Yahweh or Ha-Dabar Elohim. Yahweh and Elohim being God in either phrase.
Alice,
I have been a subscriber to BAR for many years and am a very enthusiastic supporter of Herschel Shanks. The ceramic pots at City of the Hawk will turn out to be honeypots (IMO).

Alice C. Linsley said:
Susan, you are making great connections here! It is amazing how the pieces start to fall into place when one looks in the right place for information.

Ezekiel was told to eat the scroll - the word of God - and he found it sweet. I've read that the manna eaten in the wilderness might have been honeycomb.

Biblical Archaeology Review recently reported on "finds from Tel Rehov shed a bright light on domestic religious observance in ancient Israel and, like so many archaeological finds, raise unanswered questions, reminding us how little we really know. At 25 acres, Tel Rehov is one of the largest mounds in Israel. It is located a little more than half way up the Jordan Valley between the Dead Sea and the Sea of Galilee.

Rehov is mentioned in several Egyptian inscriptions. The latest one is an inscription of Shoshenq I at the temple of Amun at Karnak, Thebes. That inscription records more than 150 place names in relation to Shoshenq’s military campaign in the Land of Israel, around 925–920 B.C.E. This military campaign is also mentioned in the Bible, where Shoshenq is referred to as “Shishak” and the event is dated by the Biblical historiographer to the fifth year of King Rehoboam’s reign, shortly after Solomon’s death and the breakup of the United Kingdom into the separate states of Israel and Judah (1 Kings 14:25–28; 2 Chronicles 12:2–9)."

The beehives were evidence of an advanced honey-producing beekeeping industry 3000 years ago. There were 100 hives in neat rows. Tel Rehov was stronlgy influenced by Egyptian/Sudanese culture although these bees were more like the Antalyan bee of central Turkey.
Michael,

The merging of Sedge and Bee is the origin of Dabar. The Pharonic throne name was built using common cultural symbols of sedge and bee. This name continued thoughout all dynasties. The Pharoh did not usurp his power but was awarded it through the authority of the Sedge and Bee. I suggest that there was a spoken oracular component that allowed this pharoah to consolidate these two economies. My evidence is the meaning of words this root was used to build (and there are many.)

The story of Deborah tells of an oracle that "speaks" of a danger that would happen in future. She uses words that are built with the root Dabar to convince a varied group to come together to defeat the enemy.

Michael Findlay said:
"The root of Deborah is Dabar (word of God) and is used more than 2.500 times in the Old Testament (first in Genesis 12:4). "

Continuing on from the last post, did you know that Dabar is pronounced "daw-baw" and Deborah is pronounced, well its self explanatory but I will type it up anyway, "deb-or-ahh". Hebrew initially did not have vowels and the word dabar would have simply been dbr but the b can also be a v so you can have dvr and it is the same word. Furthermore to confuse the issue further the context of the phrase is all important because you could actually have an epidemic happening instead of someone speaking.

Look up Strongs and check out
1697 דָּבָר da-var Word
1698 דֶּבֶר de-ver Epidemic
The only difference between the 2 is the vowel accents. No vowels in the original manuscripts means you really need to have the correct context. The ancient hand written script is, while different to the typeset, the same with both words and to top it all off the ancient hand writing did not have vowel signs. Strongs also has that so you can check it out as well.

Point of this is, take everything in the correct context
Alice,
Nimrod may be a mighty hunter but his meat would spoil soon after it was butchered. Trade would not be easy unless the game was brought alive to trading location. Honey and suph are the perfect trading commodities. Compact, easy to transport and will not spoil. Trade requires language and it seems many word origins can be traced to this city.

Alice C. Linsley said:
Susan, you are making great connections here! It is amazing how the pieces start to fall into place when one looks in the right place for information.

Ezekiel was told to eat the scroll - the word of God - and he found it sweet. I've read that the manna eaten in the wilderness might have been honeycomb.

Biblical Archaeology Review recently reported on "finds from Tel Rehov shed a bright light on domestic religious observance in ancient Israel and, like so many archaeological finds, raise unanswered questions, reminding us how little we really know. At 25 acres, Tel Rehov is one of the largest mounds in Israel. It is located a little more than half way up the Jordan Valley between the Dead Sea and the Sea of Galilee.

Rehov is mentioned in several Egyptian inscriptions. The latest one is an inscription of Shoshenq I at the temple of Amun at Karnak, Thebes. That inscription records more than 150 place names in relation to Shoshenq’s military campaign in the Land of Israel, around 925–920 B.C.E. This military campaign is also mentioned in the Bible, where Shoshenq is referred to as “Shishak” and the event is dated by the Biblical historiographer to the fifth year of King Rehoboam’s reign, shortly after Solomon’s death and the breakup of the United Kingdom into the separate states of Israel and Judah (1 Kings 14:25–28; 2 Chronicles 12:2–9)."

The beehives were evidence of an advanced honey-producing beekeeping industry 3000 years ago. There were 100 hives in neat rows. Tel Rehov was stronlgy influenced by Egyptian/Sudanese culture although these bees were more like the Antalyan bee of central Turkey.
Scroll and suph are both made from the same plant. Another form of suph is grinding into flour and baking of loaves or cakes. This probably occured before emmer was hybridized. Chala and halav could have the same root. I need to research this when I have more time. Milk and honey could be sedge and bee and the double axe could be the totem for the merging of these two trading clans.

Alice C. Linsley said:
Susan, you are making great connections here! It is amazing how the pieces start to fall into place when one looks in the right place for information.

Ezekiel was told to eat the scroll - the word of God - and he found it sweet. I've read that the manna eaten in the wilderness might have been honeycomb.

Biblical Archaeology Review recently reported on "finds from Tel Rehov shed a bright light on domestic religious observance in ancient Israel and, like so many archaeological finds, raise unanswered questions, reminding us how little we really know. At 25 acres, Tel Rehov is one of the largest mounds in Israel. It is located a little more than half way up the Jordan Valley between the Dead Sea and the Sea of Galilee.

Rehov is mentioned in several Egyptian inscriptions. The latest one is an inscription of Shoshenq I at the temple of Amun at Karnak, Thebes. That inscription records more than 150 place names in relation to Shoshenq’s military campaign in the Land of Israel, around 925–920 B.C.E. This military campaign is also mentioned in the Bible, where Shoshenq is referred to as “Shishak” and the event is dated by the Biblical historiographer to the fifth year of King Rehoboam’s reign, shortly after Solomon’s death and the breakup of the United Kingdom into the separate states of Israel and Judah (1 Kings 14:25–28; 2 Chronicles 12:2–9)."

The beehives were evidence of an advanced honey-producing beekeeping industry 3000 years ago. There were 100 hives in neat rows. Tel Rehov was stronlgy influenced by Egyptian/Sudanese culture although these bees were more like the Antalyan bee of central Turkey.
Susan Burns said:
The Afro-asiatic family of languages is built using 2 or 3 letter roots. You must go back to the root of the word to understand the meaning of how the word is used. This root harkens back to Egypt and the merging of two cultures; the tuber feeders and the beekeepers.
The root isn't the only important thing, you are taking a word and using it in only one context. The issue with that is it can have many.

I was actually editing my other post but ran out of time (we only have 15 minutes or so and I think if someone posts after you then you can't anyway) to discuss your reference to the inner sanctum and dabar. Unfortunately that is not quote correct either. The word for inner sanctum is diber and the icing on the cake is it is actually written differently. Yes the root is there albeit split in 2.

Susan Burns said:
I can definitely see how DBR could be used to describe a famine. The tubers and honey are gifts of fruitfulness from God. When God takes his gifts away, famine ensues.
I didn;t say famine, I said epidemic. There is a difference a famine indicates a food shortage, an epidemic can be many things such as disease outbreaks. Look at the context not for things you want to see.
Susan Burns said:
Did you look at the link that I provided?
Yes I did, It looks credible but there us a slight problem when a book that, apart from the Book or Mormon, is used to prop up Mormon theology is quoted. "Stephen Parker has helpfully summarized the argument in a comprehensible way in the Encyclopedia of Mormonism". I am as you may have started to realise a bit sceptical about such things.

Susan Burns said:
I have not read everything he has written but what I have read I am in complete agreement.
So your trying to debunk Christianity are you? No offence intended but your chosen quote certainly indicates it and so does the persons webpage and links.

I really think before people go looking for links to Egypt and other parts of Africa, and I am not saying they are not there, we need to get the absolute basics right first.
Michael,

First you say a person's religion should not enter into the discussion. Now you are saying their information is disqualified because they are not a specific religion. I am guessing that you are disqualifying scholars because they do not have the same religion as yourself. Doesn't Australia have freedom of religion? Why don't you spend more research time on the actual facts rather than the belief system of the writer?

An epidemic could better be described when you think of how our bees are dying. Scientists are frantically trying to find what could be the EPIDEMIC.

You have stated that there are many components of etymology. Why not find the components you are in disagreement with and state those so that we will both have a better understanding?
Susan Burns said:
Michael,
First you say a person's religion should not enter into the discussion. Now you are saying their information is disqualified because they are not a specific religion. I am guessing that you are disqualifying scholars because they do not have the same religion as yourself. Doesn't Australia have freedom of religion? Why don't you spend more research time on the actual facts rather than the belief system of the writer?
An epidemic could better be described when you think of how our bees are dying. Scientists are frantically trying to find what could be the EPIDEMIC.

You have stated that there are many components of etymology. Why not find the components you are in disagreement with and state those so that we will both have a better understanding?
I have deliberately kept my beliefs out of this because it would only serve to cloud the issue. Mormonism is a new religion, what it contains has very little to do with anything ancient and it is akin in that regard to things like Scientology.

Australia does not have freedom of religion and anyone who says we do needs to remember that we actually had a referendum on this issue and it was defeated.

Epidemic could also mean Cholera (Pakistan comes to mind at the moment), SARS (South East Asia only about 5-10 years ago), Swine Flu (world wide), it would be better to take things in context than to say it must have something to do with bees.

I have stated what I disagree with, I thought you could see that. You are saying words mean something when in fact they don't. I have given you examples of how this is not correct and you come back using very different words to try to show you are correct.

It really seems as though you are pushing for an African answer to your question and using a tenuous link in linguistics to try to show it.

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